Witaj GOŚCIU ( Zaloguj się | Rejestracja )
 
 
Reply to this topicStart new topicStart Poll

> Russian Wars, In English if you please
     
Kan
 

Nowicjusz
Grupa: Użytkownik
Postów: 1
Nr użytkownika: 5.195

 
 
post 19/04/2005, 14:05 Quote Post

Honored members of the forum,
In need of your help. I’d like to ask for your help with any texts and (or) references connected with the Russian armed forces activity throughout the history in your region and concerning its violence and war crimes against the civil population (with figures, please).

I am a Kazan tatar, Russia, and we have to struggle (in forums and private conversations as far) with the Russian nazi ideology.
As you may know, “Russizm” ideology is rising in Russia today. It is based on the “Great Past” and “Arian origin” of the nation. Their goals are the construction of the Empire where Russian nation will rule all other nations of RF and all the other Slavic (and Arian) nations. That’s nonsense at all but many Russian people do believe in those goals.

The same researches we do in other parts of the Europe and Asia: the Caucasus, the Central Asia and the East and Far East from the times of Ivan the Terrible till the present.

It will be enough if you send your texts with references or documents as messages to this brunch of the forum.

I assure you that the data will be used in polite and correct way.

Thank you
 
User is offline  PMMini Profile Post #1

     
Eumenes
 

IV ranga
****
Grupa: Użytkownik
Postów: 400
Nr użytkownika: 4.431

Zawód: student
 
 
post 5/10/2005, 11:29 Quote Post

My English is poor but I could help you in getting some informations.
I can see that you have good intentions, but be beware of danger of thinking about only one side's war crimes. You have to remember that in the years of Poland's power both sides commited a lot of acts of violence. One of the most horrible Poland's crime happened during the Great Smuta (Смутное время) when Poland treated Russia as an area of colonisation. Polish light cavalery forces called in Polish lisowczycy was a special fomation created to support False Dimitry's was known of being one of the most cruel formation in history.

But in last two centuries Russian forces comitted a lot of crimes, starting with the Massacre of Praga, the righ-banked district of Warsaw. Read about it in Wikipedia. It was only the first of Russian's genocides commited on Poles in the following years.
 
User is offline  PMMini ProfileEmail Poster Post #2

     
godfrydl
 

Diabolus in musica
*******
Grupa: Użytkownik
Postów: 2.136
Nr użytkownika: 9.524

Stopień akademicki: BANITA
Zawód: BANITA
 
 
post 11/10/2005, 12:59 Quote Post

Dear Tatar, Did you forget about the emire your ancestors build on blood and pain? Genghis-khan is probably one of your heroes
 
User is offline  PMMini Profile Post #3

     
Eumenes
 

IV ranga
****
Grupa: Użytkownik
Postów: 400
Nr użytkownika: 4.431

Zawód: student
 
 
post 11/10/2005, 13:33 Quote Post

Hey, your unfair, godfrydl! He needs facts about the Russian army in a good purpose and you accuse him about the Genghis-khan's acts?
Did you forget that he needs information to help to struggle with nazi ideology? We all know what Russian nazis think about Poland so we should help him instead of attacking. If you met polish Tatar (you know in polish Lipkowie), would you also mention Genghis-khan firstly?

Greetings,
Eumenes
 
User is offline  PMMini ProfileEmail Poster Post #4

     
Lipek
 

Unregistered

 
 
post 20/12/2005, 18:38 Quote Post

I suppose that we can mention about all polish rises and their repercusions (1794,1830,1863) - as you should know, from the beggining of existance of Moscow, characteristic thing was yo massacre native citizens of conquered countries. In the other hand, most of wars between 1'st Republic of Poland and Russians were somehow connected with war crimes (but we MUST still remember that there was no such law defining "war crimes"). In newest times we can mention about USSR ocupation in years 1939 (with support of 3rd Reich) - to destroy Polish best educated and most traditional families or to send them (as in years 1795-1914) to Syberia or provinces on Middle-East (almost every ending with "stan")or just shoot them.
Polish nobility was in the worst position - as enemies of communism they were thrown out from their houses, with no possibility to take anything and almost surely shot.
If we are talking about times after 1939 we should say something about politicy since 1944, when Russians crossed border of 2'nd Republic of Poland - all "soldats" were very brutal: they've taken what they wanted to (if someone was trying to stop them, they shot them of named as a fasist's traitor). They stealed everything what had any value.
What can I say else? Treating citizens of countires on east of Lithuania in XV and XVI century as good material for servants, for next 4 was very brutal revenge...
If I'll have some time I could search for some more, maby with concreet data information. Tatars should help each other:P Here's my e-mail: mikael2001@interia.pl
 
Post #5

     
tuxman
 

Hetman Polny imć Onufry Zagloba w służbie Forum!
******
Grupa: Moderatorzy
Postów: 1.263
Nr użytkownika: 4.809

 
 
post 20/12/2005, 19:55 Quote Post

Dear Kan – welcome to our Forum!

That's exactly that what have been said by Lipek and Eumenes.
Somehow through ages Russia with any type of Government has been acting in most cases as our aggressor.
Until we’ve had the best European cavalry called Husaria, we could defeat them. (simplest saying wink.gif ). Later our country collapsed thanks to economical reasons and to big and total freedom (anarchy?) of couple of Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth citizens (in Polish: szlachta, magnaci).
The first and real signal to simply divide Poland gave Prussian King Fryderyk II the Great – but in fact the treaty between Prussia, Russia and Austria has been signed off in St. Petersburg. Our King tried to reform Kingdom, we have had proclamation of first European Constitution – but it was simply the reason for 2nd and later on for 3rd successful attempt to divide our territory between these three occupants. Just imagine – the greatest country in Europe in XVII century – disappeared from the maps!
Since then, we didn’t have to much good relationships I could say with Russian Governments. I will not talk about mass murdering, rapes, robbery, sending Poles to the Siberia and all that stuff which Poles got from Russians since ages. During that time we had 2 uprisings – both not successful…
After 123 years, after the I World War finished, we got back freedom, but with country totally ruined (the front lines gone through Polish territory couple of times).
The next events you should know from modern history.
Secret treaty between Stalin’s man Molotow and Hitler’s man Ribentrop – when Stalin guaranteed help for Nazi aggressor. At 17th of September 1939 (17 days after that Nazi Germany forces attacked Poland) Russian Red Army again stepped into Polish territory occupying that.
Some Poles are saying after the War we’ve been still under Soviets occupation, and real freedom we got thanks to Polish citizens rush, Ronald Reagan’s policy against Soviet Union and Pope’s activities in 1989. I would say that was more illusionist freedom, because Soviet Union (after collapse of that last - Russia) still have had enough power to influence people steering our country.
From the last democratic vote which happened this year I would say we have gained at least Political Independence. That’s why we can still find a lot of not fair political and economical moves from Russian side.

But anyhow – tell more or maybe more specific – what kind of information you would like to get from us?

Best Reagrds

To Eumenes: About the Great Smuta we could tell more, isn't it? As far as I know - Moscow citizens simply opened the City Gates for Polish Forces... I think that fact indicates something.
 
User is offline  PMMini ProfileEmail Poster Post #6

 
1 Użytkowników czyta ten temat (1 Gości i 0 Anonimowych użytkowników)
0 Zarejestrowanych:


Topic Options
Reply to this topicStart new topic

 

 
Copyright © 2003 - 2017 Historycy.org
historycy@historycy.org, tel: 12 346-54-06

Kolokacja serwera, łącza internetowe:
Uniwersytet Marii Curie-Skłodowskiej